Sending kids back to school this year is especially stressful and unpredictable, yet there are many decisions needing to be made. Our experts discuss characteristics of stress, moving stress patterns toward resilience, and reducing decision fatigue related to back-to-school and COVID-19.
Send us an email: parenting@iastate.edu.
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Sending kids back to school this year is especially stressful and unpredictable, yet there are many decisions needing to be made. Our experts discuss characteristics of stress, moving stress patterns toward resilience, and reducing decision fatigue related to back-to-school and COVID-19.
Send us an email: parenting@iastate.edu.
Find us on Facebook: @scienceofparent.
This institution is an equal opportunity provider. For the full non-discrimination statement or accommodation inquiries, go to www.extension.iastate.edu/diversity/ext
Hey, welcome to The Science of Parenting podcast, where we connect you with research based information that fits your family. We'll talk about the realities of being a parent and how research can help guide our parenting decisions. I'm Mackenzie Johnson, parent of two littles with their own quirks, and I'm a parenting educator. And today we are here to talk about decision making around back to school. So many decisions to be made as parents. What are we doing with our kids? Where are they headed and all that stuff. W e know that you're working hard to make a lot of decisions about what's best for your family a nd I'm really excited about this topic today and that we have a special guest. So, I want to introduce you to our guest, Dr. David Brown, who is our behavioral health state s pecialist for Iowa State University Extension and Outreach. Now, besides his university position, he's also a licensed marriage and family therapist, a certified family l ife educator, and a parent of two grown and wonderful girls. So w e're so excited to have David join us. Thanks so much for coming on here, David.
Dr. David Brown:Thanks for having me. I'm really glad to be here today.
Mackenzie Johnson:Oh, awesome. Thank you. We know this is such an important topic and to be honest, I just kind of want to dig right in. Can we just go for it? Awesome.
Dr. David Brown:Let's do this. You know, I know you've talked about stress before on the podcast but I want to look at the idea of stress specifically related to the pandemic that we're all experiencing. Now, one of the researchers out there, Dr. Perry, d iscussed w ith that stress and thereby resilience and vulnerability can fall on the continuum across several characteristics.
Mackenzie Johnson:Mm. Okay. So now many of you who listen to our podcasts regularly know I am usually up for a little game or a little back and forth. So I have an idea here, David. So there's a couple of characteristics. What about if you, you know, we like to use this lens of research and reality, what if you share some of that research of the characteristic and maybe I'll share a little bit of parenting reality, about where that stress falls?
Dr. David Brown:Sure. That sounds great. So are you ready? I'm going to give you the first continuum.
Mackenzie Johnson:I can do it.
Dr. David Brown:Okay. The first continuum looks at whether the stress feels chaotic or predictable.
Mackenzie Johnson:Okay. Well, I can say there's a lot of times that this has felt way more chaotic coming back to school than a typical year. Right? I feel like a typical, you know, when you get ready to take your kids back to school, it's pretty predictable. You need their school supplies, you would make sure they have a backpack, maybe some new school shoes, you know, whatever our kids need to get ready for school. This year I feel like it's been a lot more chaotic, you know, whether we're sending our kids to face to face school or online, or even chaos in terms of knowing what your options are, right? Some school districts had released a plan and then had to take it back and, you know, made a new plan. And so that's been chaotic.
Dr. David Brown:Oh yeah. And within that chaos, we just had to make so many more decisions that we've typically, typically usually had to do with this pandemic.
Mackenzie Johnson:Oh yeah. So I would say the pandemic, I think, has made life, you know, that stress a lot more chaotic than predictable.
Dr. David Brown:That's for sure. Are you ready for the second one?
Mackenzie Johnson:Let's do it.
Dr. David Brown:Hey, the second continuum is whether the stress is severe and prolonged or moderate.
Mackenzie Johnson:Oof. All right. In particular to prolonged, I think that for a lot of families, you know, this pandemic and how it's affecting our lives is maybe a lot more prolonged than people initially expected or anticipated. And so I would say it's been prolonged and I think, yeah, whether it feels severe, moderate, you know, really depends on, you know, each family. But I think there's been times when it's felt really severe, like man, will everything... will things ever go back to normal? Can I handle if they don't? You know, but then there's other times where now I feel like I'm kind of in a place where it's a little more moderate, right. I've maybe settled into these new routines a little more and it feels like something I can handle. So again, both ends.
Dr. David Brown:Yeah. That's correct, you know, some of us have gotten used to kind of the new normal. And so the stress is a little bit more moderate as things seem a little bit more real, c ause we're doing it over and over again, r e lated to the pandemic.
Mackenzie Johnson:So how about that third one?
Dr. David Brown:You ready for the last one?
Mackenzie Johnson:Yeah.
Dr. David Brown:Okay. Finally, we're going to look at whether stress feels uncontrolled or controlled.
Mackenzie Johnson:Oh, okay. I would say absolutely, as a parent, I feel like the pandemic is out of my control. Right. So that stress feels uncontrolled. You know, that's like an absolute, that one was an easy one for me. But I do think that I have found some peace, you know, and kind of a way to navigate by finding the things I can control, you know, things like choosing, you know, I wear my mask and practicing healthy self care, you know, and stress reducing like stress management strategies and even stuff like I have a plan that I need to check in with my daughter regularly and see if she has questions about what's going on or what she's heard. And so the finding those things I can control has really helped that stress feel more manageable.
Dr. David Brown:Oh, I'm sure. You know, and, and every family has a little bit different reality, related to this pandemic. You know, we know that some communities have a little bit, few more resources available, maybe different, public health rates within the pandemic. And, you know, they come from different circumstances prior to the pandemic as well. But the thing is, there's some great news that Dr. Perry does provide us some very specific strategies then how we can help move our stress patterns and to a direction more towards resilience.
Mackenzie Johnson:Absolutely. And so that was a part of this research, right? Was that as we look at this continuum of stress across those three continuums, it's also whether our stress is making us vulnerable or helping us build resilience. And I just love that we've talked a little bit about resilience before. And so thinking about building a family that is resilient to help with this stress in the middle of this pandemic, there's some really, like you said, those great specific strategies. Can you walk us through, can you walk us through those strategies?
Dr. David Brown:Sure. There's some really great tips out there that can help all families. Number one, maintaining daily structure not only helps the children, but also helps the parents as well. Family meals together is always a good way to connect and communicate within families. Try limiting the media intake, especially things that maybe not sound so great. We need to also keep exercising every day. Certainly reaching out and helping others is a good thing to do. Sleep hygiene, getting, getting a good night's sleep also impacts with how well we're doing. And here's the hard one, we have to stay positive and future focused.
Mackenzie Johnson:Yes. Yes. Okay. So having some of those structure, like daily structure, which might include some family routines like meal time, you know, and things like that. Also thinking about limiting that media intake, you know, that not that where you need to stick our heads in the sand, but that we're choosing to not be constantly bombarded with that high amount of"breaking news" kind of stress. So limiting that media intake and then exercise, reach out, help others, think about those sleep patterns. I am guilty of that. I am quick to let that sleep hygiene slip away from me. I'd be staying up late and then I'm still getting up early. So I got to work on that one. And then of course trying to say positive and future focused is really great.
Dr. David Brown:And that sleep hygiene is so important because, you know, if you don't get a good eight hour sleep, sometimes, you know, other things fall apart, you just not feel as well during the course of your day, not as productive. And so it's really important to get that good sleep hygiene.
Mackenzie Johnson:Absolutely. Well, and so, okay. So I shared that maybe not doing always so great at the sleep, the healthy sleep patterns and hygiene. What about some of the things we are doing well? What would you say you've been doing well, David, during the pandemic of these strategies?
Dr. David Brown:You know, we're in a situation where, you know, our kids are grown. So, my wife and I, even when we're working at home, we're able to kind of maintain a fairly consistent structure. You know, we kinda got up at the same time. We quit work at the same time, even though we were working at home. And so, we got into a new, kind of daily pattern fairly quickly. I think that was very helpful for us.
Mackenzie Johnson:Excellent.
Dr. David Brown:How about you?
Mackenzie Johnson:You know, I would say actually the thing that I feel like, like, Oh yeah, family meals. We've kind of continued that norm. That was one thing, you know, as other things changed of yes. Like working from home, you know, and all those things that we were still able to maintain that routine of kind of what we were typically doing with our family of coming together, eating at the table, kinds of things. So whether that night it was cereal or not, I won't say, but having those family meals together. So, those are some really great and kind of simple strategies that Dr. Perry gives us. We can help reduce that stress and build resilience, right? So instead of feeling vulnerable to stress and other problems, we can help build our resilience with these patterns. And so we know that being back to school and the transition that comes with it is normally stressful. And then we add a layer of the pandemic and then we add another layer of just kind of typical, right. What other normal stressors is going on. And it can feel like a lot. It can really feel like a lot.
Dr. David Brown:It is a lot.
Mackenzie Johnson:It is a lot! Yeah. Not just feels like it, it is a lot, you know, so we do want to look at those ways that we can navigate that stress, right? Some of it's uncontrolled-- that we're not in charge of whether the stress exists, but how we navigate it is within our control. So, and we can build our resilience that way.
Dr. David Brown:That's right. That's so important. Hey, I do want to cover another topic while I'm here?
Mackenzie Johnson:Yes, please.
Dr. David Brown:And that topic is, decision-making and something that we call decision fatigue. Now you may have heard this term before, but I want to talk in terms in Dr. Roy Baumeister's research. Now he and his colleagues have discussed that the process of making choices may itself drain some of our own mental resources, thereby leaving us less likely to think clearly and thus make good decisions and so even bigger decisions that many of us are having to make can even be more draining.
Mackenzie Johnson:Yes. Oh yes. But I just can so relate to that concept of decision fatigue and those regular kind of choices we make in a day, just they can really add up in terms of how much energy they take from us, right?
Dr. David Brown:Oh, absolutely.
Mackenzie Johnson:Especially, you know, if you're a single parent or the parent who tends to manage and coordinate more of the family decisions, that's a lot.
Dr. David Brown:That's a lot. I mean, you know, there's just exceptionally additional pressure on certainly those single parents or the family members that make those decisions. Now, fortunately, in my household, my wife makes most of those decisions. So unfortunately she probably has more decision fatigue than I do.
Mackenzie Johnson:Yes. Yes. Well, and I think recognizing that even within your co-parenting relationship. That, you know, finding, we've talked about that, finding a balance in your division of like household and childcare labor, that you are happy with as a couple. And if that, if it makes sense for a certain person to do more of that, recognizing that their decision fatigue will be very real, and making those decisions together, when it makes sense and recognizing if someone makes more of them, there will likely be decision fatigue, especially in the midst of making all these big decisions in the pandemic.
Dr. David Brown:You know, and there's some strategies that can help fortunately, that Dr. Baumeister provided. So, let's talk a little bit about those.
Mackenzie Johnson:Absolutely. Yes, please.
Dr. David Brown:Now, one of the best ways we can do is- think about this- is that we can eliminate some unnecessary or unimportant decisions by making things routine, like brushing your teeth. I mean, for most of us, we don't have to decide whether or not we're going to brush your teeth. It's just a habit that we just do all the time. So that can have some kind of impact on how families kind of work together.
Mackenzie Johnson:Absolutely. And I even think about, you know, in our family, you know, in our own reality, we have a bedtime routine that's just a habit, right. So no matter who's putting the kids together, it's the same, like the same steps that we're walking through. And so it's not a choice of whether or not we need to brush teeth or whether or not we're going to put on on pajamas because that's just how it operates. And so it eliminates some of that choice by having it as a habit.
Dr. David Brown:Yeah. So things that just happened like that. You don't have to think about, and it just reduces our decision fatigue.
Mackenzie Johnson:I love that. I love that.
Dr. David Brown:Yeah, Here's another strategy is to give yourself some time to regulate between decisions.
Mackenzie Johnson:Hmm. All right, David, that sounds a little bit, I think you've heard our phrase"Stop, Breathe, Talk," which is one of our favorite parenting strategies. That sounds a little bit like that, right? Taking a little time to regulate. And this one is talking about in between decisions in particular though, right?
Dr. David Brown:Sure. That's an amazing example. I mean, it's a good rule to follow is that when you make a little decision, like what's for supper, then you take a little break to regulate. But when you make a really big decision, like whether or not your children will be completing school online or face to face, you need to make sure you have a big break.
Mackenzie Johnson:Oh, I love that. And that's easy to remember, right? If I'm making little decisions, you know, even a lot of little decisions, little breaks can help me regulate, but if I'm making huge decisions, you know, that feel like they have a huge impact, I'm going to need more time and rest in between trying to make another decision. I can talk about that. Even with, we recently moved our home, you know, to a new, a new home and the amount of decisions that feel like big decisions, you know, where we're hanging stuff, what to unpack, all those kinds of things. So little decisions, little break, big decisions, big break. I like that one.
Dr. David Brown:Yeah. And the other thing is we need to look at when we're making decisions, we have to be rested and refreshed. That's the hard one. You know.
Mackenzie Johnson:David, I gotta be honest as a parent of two little kids. I don't know if I ever really feel that refreshed and relaxed or rested.
Dr. David Brown:Well, I know the pandemic is, you know, it seems like we're working harder with the pandemic and I think parents and everyone's kind of struggling with feeling rest and refresh. So, you know, you're right on track with that.
Mackenzie Johnson:Well, and in all seriousness, I know like, yes, and maybe it's like,"Oh, will I ever be rested again?" but there is a reality of like, there are times during the day when I know I am more refreshed or more rested. And other times during the day when I'm not. Like, if I've noticed, if I like my, my co-parent and I are trying to talk about something over dinner, when we're in the midst of like routines and trying to connect with the kids after being gone all day and all that stuff, that's not a good time for us to try to make a decision because I'm not refreshed. And I'm not relaxed.
Dr. David Brown:Exactly.
Mackenzie Johnson:Versus trying to make those decisions and have those conversations, like after the kids have gone to bed or if we have a chance to catch each other over lunch and talk on the phone or something. And so those are times when I'm a little more rested and you know, in a better head space.
Dr. David Brown:Those are really great times to make decisions. The other thing we need to think about is the idea of letting big decisions marinate. And what I mean by that is that giving it time to consider lots of options and then give yourself permission to set aside the idea for awhile so that your mind can wander and kind of peruse about it a little bit.
Mackenzie Johnson:Okay. I love that. Marinate. I like that. A lot of times our Science of Parenting team, when we're talking about, you know, decisions for the podcast or working through topics or something, I like, I might say, we might say, we need to noodle on it, which is the same thing. Like we talk about it, we take in the information and then our brain just needs to swirl it around a little while before we make an official decision. So marinate, I, gosh, I like that a lot. Like, let it sit a while before you officially decide.
Dr. David Brown:That's correct. And here's the hard one. And here's a hard suggestion. It's suggested that we practice getting more comfortable with being undecided. That's a tough one.
Mackenzie Johnson:Yeah that's a hard one. I'm- I tend to be a person that, yeah. Once I've taken in the information, I'm like, all right, I've decided, I'm ready to do it right now. It's like, wait. So practicing that slow down and saying, you know what? I don't have to know this right now. I don't have to decide this right now. And that's actually a phrase that Donna, my supervisor- has helped remind me throughout the years is, you know, Mackenzie, what about just not right now? Like, you don't have to say no. Right. I don't have to say, I'll never decide. I can just say,"I don't have to decide right now." So practice being comfortable with being undecided.
Dr. David Brown:Yeah. And that's a tough one because, you know, we all like to check off our boxes and say like,"I'm done with that," so I can move on, but sometimes you just have to let them sit for awhile and be undecided. And that's a tough one for all of us.
Mackenzie Johnson:Yes. Yes. And, you know, we want to be able to keep those strategies in mind to keep that decision fatigue at bay. Right. We know that that's going to take away our energy and make it harder for us to make good decisions. and so we want to make sure that we kind of keep these strategies tucked in our pocket so that we can make decisions with kind of this clear mind and sound logic, especially important decisions like we're talking about with our kids and our parenting.
Dr. David Brown:That's right. So we really want to work to keep our, you know, decision fatigue at bay so we can make decisions, good decisions, about being back to school and other topics this year with a clear mind and really sound logic.
Mackenzie Johnson:Excellent. Excellent. All right. So we've walked through some strategies related to stress, right? Working on building resilience rather than vulnerable by using some of those basic strategies. We talked about with structure and helping others. And then also talking about that decision fatigue. It is very real for parents right now, particularly around this transition back to school. Luckily we have some strategies there too, letting ideas marinate. I'm going to cling to that word, David. I like that. I like that'marinate' word. And then the other great news is that we actually have some really great resources available to us that we want to make sure we share with you today. So some from Iowa State Extension in particular, and just some general things that we, that are available to you as parents that can help you with this decision making process.
Dr. David Brown:Sure. You know, the first resource, and I think it's an amazing resource, I'm going to share is the Iowa Concern Hotline. You know the Iowa Concern Hotline has been around since 1985 and it's a free service connecting Iowans with information to help them kind of navigate through a variety of life circumstances. Their services are available 24 hours a day, seven days a week at no charge. Through the Iowa Concern, you can access a, have access to stress counselors as well as resource and referral information on a wide variety of topics. The services are provided through Iowa State University Extension and Outreach. You can contact them by going to 1-800-447-1985. Language interpretation services are also available.
Mackenzie Johnson:Excellent. Yeah, that's a great resource. We've mentioned it before in the podcast and that's something we absolutely want our listeners to remember is available to them. When you're feeling stressed. When you have questions about legal matters or financial matters, or just stress in general, you can call that Iowa Concern Hotline.
Dr. David Brown:Available 24 hours a day, it's just a great resource.
Mackenzie Johnson:Anytime and totally free, which is great. One resource that I want to remind you about is that we've actually covered some of the topics that relate to some of the strategies we've shared here on our podcast, on The Science of Parenting. You know, we did our bonus episodes, a couple of bonus episodes on rituals and routines in the middle of the pandemic. So right. One of the strategies was routines like family meals, and checking in with our kids and things like that. So you have those bonus episodes. And then also remember, season two was all about, we call them"the six super powers of self care." And so right when you're draining your energy, one of the things I've actually kind of myself been practicing is when I've noticed my stress is really high, I've maybe lowered the bar on some other things, because I said, I'm saying,"Hey, I'm really stressed, which means I really need self care." So look at those episodes on the six superpowers of self care.
Dr. David Brown:I'm going to have to go back and watch that episode.
Mackenzie Johnson:Yeah, they're good ones. They're good ones.
Dr. David Brown:Hey, another important resource that was recently shared on our own Iowa State University Extension and Outreach site was some publications called"COVID-19 Childcare Considerations." Now these publications are designed to help parents, like you, make the important decisions around childcare for your children in the midst of this pandemic. Those resources are available free at the Iowa State University Extension and Outreach Store online.
Mackenzie Johnson:Yes. And I should mention, all of the resources that we're mentioning here are going to be available on our website, scienceofparenting.org. So if you're like,"Hey, what was that called?" We are going to have them listed out in a blog post for you that you can scope out. So we'll give you links there. But I do also want to mention another great resource actually came out of the University of Wisconsin-Madison, which is Wisconsin's state extension system. And it's something called a Decision Worksheet for Moving Forward During COVID-19. It's gonna lay out some really great considerations that are specific for you, your family, your reality. So you can make informed decisions about what's best for your family in the midst of this pandemic.
Dr. David Brown:That's sounds like an amazing resource.
Mackenzie Johnson:Mm, it is.
Dr. David Brown:Hey, finally, I want to make sure to mention another recent Iowa resource that we've been partnering with, and that is COVID Recovery Iowa, and they were actually kind enough to send a little snippet so you can hear more about the work and the services they offer. So let's listen to that.
COVID Recovery Iowa Representative:This isn't your typical public service announcement. It's more personal than that. It's your life we're talking about. COVID-19 may have changed your daily routine, your family's finances and your sense of security. Not sure where to turn? Call COVID Recovery Iowa for free counseling and resources to get back to normal. Call COVID Recovery Iowa,(844) 775-9276. Brought to you by COVID Recovery Iowa.
Mackenzie Johnson:Oh, excellent. So COVID Recovery Iowa, a great resource for us to be able to tap into, along with so many other resources, right? Publications, decision making tools, things that are going to give us more information, as well as COVID Recovery Iowa, and our Iowa Concern Hotline. So, so many things to help parents make decisions, you know, about what's best for their kids and their family. Like I said, we are going to have a blog post here, that you can go find on our scienceofparenting.org blog and website that will give you the links to these resources so that we make sure that you can get access to what you need. So find all of our information there. So I think that kinda covers it, David. You know, we've talked through this stress and, you know, that's specific to the pandemic, whether it feels controlled or uncontrolled or moderate or severe, predictable or chaotic, all of those things, understanding that stress. And then talking about the reality of the decision fatigue parents are experiencing right in the midst of this pandemic. So many choices to make. And a lot of us have just made these choices about back to school. And then now that we're back in school, there's a whole other set of decisions to be making.
Dr. David Brown:It's tough times out there. And so, you know, we're certainly glad to share all these resources and information to as many folks who are interested.
Mackenzie Johnson:Absolutely. And I want to say thank you so much to you, David, for joining us today to talk about such an important topic for parents. So thanks for, thanks for joining us here on The Science of Parenting podcast.
Dr. David Brown:Thank you for having me today, Mackenzie, and I really appreciate being here.
Mackenzie Johnson:Thanks, David. Yes. So covering so much good stuff today, right? That decision fatigue. Oh my gosh. I feel like I could talk about examples of that forever in the midst of parenting in a pandemic. But we laid out some really specific strategies that research tells us can help us navigate, right, this really difficult time. And we know this transition back to school, it looks different this year and that in itself is kind of a hard thing. We've talked about rituals and so, back to school is also kind of a ritual and so that having to look different this year can be tough. So make sure you tap in those strategies, check out those resources, utilize what's best for you. Your family. Remember our job is to share the research. You get to decide what's best for your family and your own reality. So thanks for joining us today on The Science of Parenting podcast. Remember, you can subscribe to listen to us on Apple, Spotify, or your favorite podcast app. You can watch us on Facebook and every once in a while, you can catch us there live where we answer your comments and questions. So come along with us as we tackle the ups and downs, the ins and outs, and the research and reality, all around The Science of Parenting.
Anthony Santiago:The Science of Parenting is a research-based education program posted by Lori Hayungs and Mackenzie Johnson, produced by Mackenzie DeJong with research and writing by Barbara Dunn Swanson. Send in questions and comments to parenting@iastate.edu and connect with us on Facebook and Twitter. This program is brought to you by Iowa State University Extension and Outreach. This institution is an equal opportunity provider. For the full non-discrimination statement or accommodation inquiries, go to www.extension.iastate.edu/diversity/ext.